Elizabeth Barrette (ysabetwordsmith) wrote,
Elizabeth Barrette
ysabetwordsmith

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Give the Refugees an Island

So this rich guy offered to buy an island to host the refugees pouring into Europe.  This would give them a place to stay with others who share their language and culture, without bothering those areas in Europe that really don't want refugees. Furthermore, he cleverly suggested something I've been saying: put immigrants to work taking care of each other, get them building homes and service facilities, etc.  They're just ordinary people who've been run out of home by psychos; they must have useful skills.  And this  guy actually has enough money to make things happen.  I hope it works.

Also this is the point where Italy and Greece should take the offer or else STFU about not wanting refugees on their turf.  Especially Greece, with a very plausible exchange of selling an island, addressing the refugee problem, and getting a little boost and maybe some advice on fixing their mangled economy.
Tags: economics, news, politics, safety
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  • 16 comments
Problem is the only thing that would actually stop the refugee crisis is to allow democracy to flourish in the Middle East.
There are other options, some better, some worse.

People elsewhere could just say, "Sure, come live here instead of with the crazy people," and eventually the ravaged lands would just empty out except for the lunatics.

Other countries could step in and stop the carnage, which has occasionally worked, but usually interfering in other people's business doesn't end well.

Sanctions and other less-violent solutions are unlikely to work on combatants who aren't exactly being very rational.

Democracy might help, but hell, look at America. It's kind of a wreck. Some other countries have had great luck with it, others not so much. The best ones right now are socialists! What the Middle East needs is sane healthy leadership. The exact format is more open to debate.
Totally depopulating Syria and leaving Bashar and Asma to rule over a desert and some ruined cities is fine with me.

Democracy would help. The thing is they've been asking for democracy for years and the rest of the world is like "nope."
Other countries could step in and stop the carnage, which has occasionally worked, but usually interfering in other people's business doesn't end well.

That is extremely true. The main (if not only) reason there are so many extremists and so much unrest in the middle east is the constant meddling by other powers. Iran's democratic government was deposed by foreign forces (the CIA, I think) and replaced by extremists, Iraq only exists because of British invaders forcing three majorly different ethnic groups together under one flag and only stayed together because of Hussein's brutal dictatorship (Iraq probably won't exist in 10 or 15 years, it will have broken into at least three different countries), Palestinian land was stolen by outside invaders to make Israel and the Israelis just keeps murdering the Palestinians and taking more and more of their land, the USSR trained and armed the Taliban, the US trained and armed ISIS, I'm sure British colonialism has something to do with why India and Pakistan hate each other so much, and there's probably a lot more I'm either forgetting or not aware of yet.

Re: Well...

ysabetwordsmith

5 years ago

This sounds like the sort of thing guaranteed to backfire. Although I guess living in the crime-ridden slum this would end up as is better than living in Syria right now.
Compare it to where they're likely to end up living otherwise: a previously existing crime-ridden slum, or a camp. Sure there's a chance this would go to shit. But I think that the chance of it producing a decent place to live, while far from guaranteed, is probably higher than other options.

Crucially, the donor wants the refugees to build their own homes. Involving people in their own neighborhood drastically raises the chance of success. Just as one example, they would presumably choose a layout and house designs pleasing to Syrian people. This is not necessarily easy to find anywhere else, but on their own island, they would be free to meet their own tastes and needs in housing. It works much better than a top-down solution.
Curious why you assume they're going to end up in a crime ridden slum...
I think the crucial factor is population density...over time. Optimal or sub-optimal density would make people want to stay forever. High density for a short time would make people glad to leave. High density for a long time, especially for a younger generation growing up with it, would trigger territorial aggressive acts--fouling and destroying turf, violently attacking others--and that's what makes a slum.

Human reactions to overcrowding are more subtle than those of farm animals, but not really different.
Because that's what always happens. It's not like 'take a group of people and shove them off in a corner so that we can forget about them' has never been tried before.
It doesn't always happen, it often happens. Beware of absolutes. Australia started out as a penal colony and is now a lovely nation, although it still faces some challenges due to its roots.

Yes, slums happen. It is bad when they happen. But if we believe they necessarily happen then we abdicate responsibility for them, and close the door to other options.

What I think gives this proposal potential is that the donor is talking about putting people in charge of their own facilities. If it plays out that way, I think the results will be much better than if someone else is in charge of that. When dealing with trauma survivors, one of the most vital ways to help is restoring their agency, and another is giving them resources to solve their own problems. To make it work even better, I'd keep an eye on the practical parts -- "Okay, here's your island and your current budget. Do you have any architects in this group? Anyone who worked in civic support like sewers or plumbing? If you're missing any major work types who need to consult on this, we can fill in gaps from European volunteers, or you can try to attract others of your people who are staying elsewhere."

I think this is a skill we're going to need sadly often in the future. It's not a new idea. The Republic of the Maldives is already working on a resettlement fund and scoping out islands and other properties, understanding that their island nation will almost certainly be flooded within the next century or two. There's another island up in Alaska that's washing away. This kind of habitat foreclosure is typical of climate change. (I would therefore advise choosing a tall Mediterranean island for this project.) If we can learn how to move people in groups and resettle them as a cohesive society, that's less damaging than scattering them far and wide.

Plus it's good practice for settling colonies on other worlds. Our local history with colonies ... has, uh, sucked a lot. Hopefully we could do better, here's a chance to practice, let's do that. Hm, maybe we should see if NASA or other space programs have any good ideas that the refugees might find helpful. We could test out various technology for pop-up, extruded, and other prefab housing -- definitely an improvement over tents or shanties while the permanent buildings are under construction.
I kind of want to see this happen because it would be the 'only in books' sort of thing coming to life. ;)

Of course somewhere down the road there might be the issue of taxation. For example, if Greece sold him an island, there might be the expectation that the refugees wold pay taxes to the Grecian government, whereas this billionaire might anticipate, having 'declared independence', that it's his own private island nation.
I'd call that a negotiable point, and in fact, a feature instead of a bug.

You want to settle on a Greek island? Here's the price for a private island in Greece. Here are the laws and tax code of Greece. Now Greece has a bunch of new people with seed money to get them started. Yay!

You want your own island as a free nationality? That's going to cost a LOT more. Greece now has a ginormous chunk of money to help shore up its damaged economy, and has a new neighbor hopefully fond of Greece for providing a homeland.

It depends on what people are willing to charge/pay and what they want.
Middle East watcher Sharona Schwartz reports that Syria is now requiring non-Muslims to sign the sort of "contract" that usually applies to non-Muslims in Muslim countries. No proselytizing for other religions, no public flouting of Muslim rules of behavior, tax to make up for the amount they don't pay in zakat. People live with that. So the crisis may already be subsiding. (Or not, depending on how much overcrowding may be produced if refugees feel that they can go home now...)
Oops...the link should've been in that:
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/09/06/heres-the-contract-the-islamic-state-group-is-forcing-christians-to-sign-in-syria/?
(Trigger alert: it's The Blaze, so you *know* the presentation will be inflammatory and some of the comments will be just plain hateful.)
Actually, there's a sorta-precedent for this in the states--an island off the coast of Maine (Malaga Island, now known as Vacationland) that was bought by a freed slave named Benjamin Darling. He lived there, along with his descendants, other people who married them, and their children. It was a racially integrated community.

The island is now sometimes known as "the Shame," which should give you a clue as to how it ended up. Around 1911, the denizens were evicted, made homeless, or (if they tried to stay) institutionalized under dubious circumstances and/or castrated.

So yeah. A nice idea, but seeing as it'd be the refugees moved, rather than the bigotry, I have a hard time imagining it ending well for them.

--Rogan

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